39. What To Do When A Sale Goes Wrong

Recorded live on location at White House Custom Colour, Erica discusses how she turned a sale that didn't go as planned into a chance to build trust, confidence and clients that come back again and again

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 Hey everybody, and welcome. I'm Matt, senior Client Success Manager for White House Custom Color, and we are hanging out with Erica Ewing. Thank you so much for being with us here today. I'm so excited to be here. Absolutely. So before we start chatting, just wanna make a couple announcements so everybody's up to date here.

Um, if you do have, um, any questions for Erica as we're going along the way, make sure and put them into the chat. We can get her to answer them on air if you're listening to this and watching this on the recording. Put them into the questions or into the comments and we know where to find her. So we'll get the answers to your questions that way.

Um, if you have not hit the subscribe button on the WCC YouTube, make sure and do that so you get notified of cool events like we're doing today that are coming up. Um, follow along on Instagram at WCC Pro and for all of your product details, sizing options, all the good stuff, check out wcc.com. So again, thank you so much for being here with us today.

We really appreciate it. You and the guy in the back of the room here that didn't want to be on air today, flew in from Massachusetts yesterday. We did. First time in Minneapolis. First time. Mm-hmm. Minneapolis first timer. I saw your post on Instagram, the, the shot of downtown and the, and the, the plane coming in.

That was pretty cool. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Um, so let's talk to begin with, before we get into our topic today, a little bit of background about you and the business. Can you kind of fill us in a little bit about, um, where y'all started? Sure. So before I opened my studio, I worked in marketing. Okay. That's my education, that's my background.

I worked for, um, an advertising agency for several years. I worked client side, always responsible for, um, lead generation for. Uh, creative strategy campaigns for driving leads for our clients. Okay. Um, and so that's a lot of my passion is like driving new revenue, driving new clients, that sort of thing.

Okay. Um, I made the transition to open a photography studio after I had had my first son. Okay. So when I worked in marketing, the schedules were grueling. Um, I was working, you know, 10 hours a day. Yep. And priorities shifted. Once I had a baby, and so I knew that that wasn't the life that I wanted to, to lead at that point.

Yep, totally. I had already dipped my toes in photography, so while I was com completing my business degree back in college, I needed four credits to graduate and I took a, uh, black and white film photography class developing my own prints, and that's what started the, the bug. Yeah. For photography. A lot, A lot of times that's how it happens.

Yeah. Just like, Ooh, that was really cool. It was just this fluke. Chance that I really got into, like, got my, got into it in that way. And, um, and so while I was working full-time, I kept taking photography classes at the New England School of Photography in Boston. And I would take evening classes. So I would work these long days and then I would drive to Boston, take my classes.

And it just fulfilled me in a way that was different from my day job. Mm-hmm. I had shot my first wedding before I had left. It was the biggest juicy of a wedding. It was like 200 people, all of these loud aunts yelling over my shoulders. Big wedding party, you know, like 12 hours of coverage. It was all of the things and you stuck with it.

I took a year off to recover. It took me a year to recover, but I realized I really loved that. Um, and so that's, that was basically the catalyst to start my own business, was the combination of that passion and that excitement about around creating. Creating something really beautiful for my clients to hold onto and, um, and then wanting to have a life that was separate from a nine to five corporate where I could control my hours, I could be there for my son.

Um, now I have two boys. And so it's that work life balance that we've continued to carry on for the last 15 years now. That's awesome. Yeah. So 2010. Is kind of roughly what you're talking about timeline wise, right? Yes. Yep, yep. And I know from when we were talking about content for today's live that you were living with your in-laws.

Yes. And you also had a toddler. Yes. And the, uh, the studio was a place of, of, uh, refuge Yes. For you. Yes. At that time. So, um, when you first started out, I know you mentioned like it kind of became more of a business, started off a little bit more as a hobby. Is that correct? Was that how you would describe it?

Absolutely. Yeah. So, um, even though I had this business knowhow and this, you know, mark marketing experience, I was definitely running my business as a part-time hobby. Mm-hmm. Um, at that time, Ben, my husband was still a, a full-time civil engineer. Yeah. So we were living off of his salary and we were building a new home.

Um, and we were living with my in-laws who were retired at the time. So it was my in-laws. My toddler and myself under one roof while my husband was at work all day. And I, again, sort what could possibly go wrong, right? I started to crave an outside experience, right? So we stumbled into this opportunity to get a studio space for a very, very low price.

Mm-hmm. It was a no-brainer, even just it was worth it to me just to give me a space outside of the house. Yeah. And so that's how I started a studio. Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. So we're going to dive deeper into Ben's, um, story and how that all works with you as a couple here in a little bit. But, um, when you guys are working together now currently, how are you dividing what you do at the studio?

Like, what is his responsibility? What's your responsibility? Or do you just do it all and he just gets a paycheck? He is just, yeah, he is the pretty face. He's the pretty face. He's a pretty face on. Yeah. Um, so he is more behind the scenes. He's like the wizard behind the curtain. Okay. Who just makes everything happen.

So I'm the one who's really, um, working with the clients. I'm shooting the sessions. I'm the one, we're shooting weddings. I'm the primary photographer at weddings. He's the primary videographer. So we, about eight years ago-ish, added video. Um, to our studio, which has been amazing. Awesome. And, um, and then he also is responsible for production of those films and also all of our print production too.

So he works with White House Yes. Quite a bit. Yes, he does. We get a lot of emails from Ben. Yes. Which it's, it's super nice to meet him actually in person. Yes. So one thing that really was very poignant when we were talking about, um, today is career day. And how you guys decided to join forces, because I think, you know, even though there's probably not that direct story out there, there's probably a lot of very similar reasons that a husband and wife team work together.

And just like you said, you know, you, you want to be available, you wanna be able to set your own hours. So tell us about career day. Yeah. So, um. Leading up to career day. So what we're talking about is preschool career day. Okay. For my, for my oldest son now. Yeah. And they were asking the kids what they wanted to be and my son said he wanted to be a drummer.

In a rockstar band. Awesome. That's what he wanted to do. I fully support that. Yes, yes. Um, and so Ben had said, how come you don't wanna be a civil engineer? Maybe, was it somebody at his school that asked him that? You asked him, um, how come you don't wanna be an engineer? And he said, because I would never see my family, because Ben was working full-time as a civil engineer, and then he was going to town hearings in the evenings, and so he might leave the house.

At six 30 in the morning and not get home until 10:00 PM at night. Yeah. So to hear a 4-year-old say that that's tough is really devastating. Yeah. Yeah. Immediate change necessary. Yes. And so, yeah. And you and you did that. Yeah. And, and on top of that, he was shooting weddings with me because we were never seeing each other.

So even before that, it was like our son was almost like the baton that we were passing in between each other where I was working all weekend. He was working all week. We never saw each other. So he, that's actually how he got into taking pictures and got the interest was so he could spend more time with me.

Yeah. But then he was spending zero time with our son. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Well that, um, that was a good change to happen. Yeah. And, and the reason that I think that this is all relevant to where we're gonna go next with the, the sale gone wrong is in that process of making that decision, and we'll, we'll talk more about this in a little bit.

You guys set some lofty goals. You, you went to, um. IIPS 100%. You started very much in a product based environment and you made those changes that were necessary. Now everybody knows when you're, when you're making changes and you're going into something that is a, a new realm for you, there can be highs and there can be lows.

Yep. And, you know, discussing and when you mentioned, you know, saving a sale that has gone wrong. I was like, Ooh, my ears just perked up. Like, okay, we talk about the, the, the rosy side of this a lot, right? And how it can be wonderful, but there, there can be challenges to it too. So I'm really excited to, to get into this.

So, um, first of all, can you just describe a sale gone wrong? Like what, what does that mean in your, in your business world? Yeah, absolutely, and I do, I do think that this is such an important topic because. As photographers, we have the ability to create heirlooms for our clients that are unlike anything that they're gonna be able to do for themselves.

Absolutely. And so I personally feel, as a photographer, I have a responsibility to my clients to do something with their pictures. Right. But there are so many photographers who just shoot and burn. Mm-hmm. And deliver the digitals because that's easier. Yeah, and I think that they're doing a major disservice to their clients and it's, it's set in a total judgment free way because I know that it can be really intimidating to sell products.

There's a ton of. Know how that you need. Mm-hmm. Um, which is why just, just knowledge of the products itself. Yes. Yeah. Yes. Mm-hmm. And then there's the design and there's the, oh, the, like, there's a lot that goes into that. So I understand the hesitation. Um, but it is so important for our clients because so many people, I go into client homes all the time and they have literally zero pictures.

Of their family or they have a very badly printed, like four by six in a frame. And it breaks my heart because I know what these prints mean to not only to them as parents, but to their kids as they grow up. Absolutely. You know, prints, prints in your home, increase self-esteem and Yes. Um, and so many good, beautiful benefits.

Right. Um, so it's really important. So I was talking with a, a photographer recently about. Album sales specifically for weddings, and she said I had the worst experience trying to sell my client an upgraded album that I don't know if I'll ever do it again. Totally gun shy. So basically what happened is.

She worked with this couple. She had a great connection with them, right? She absolutely adored them. She loved the wedding. She was so proud of the wedding pictures that she created for them. The whole process was great. They pre-ordered an album as part of their package up front. Okay? She spent a really long amount of time.

Thinking through this design, very intentional, designed to this beautiful album that she just knew her client was going to love, right? Yep. And she emailed the design over to her client and she said, I love this. I know you're gonna love it. There are four additional spreads that I'm showing you. You can keep them or not.

Here's the extra cost. Let me know what you think. And then it was crickets. And then a few days later, she got a very angry phone call from the bride's mom. Saying, how dare you, essentially. And the mom went into mama bear mode. Of course. Yeah. Um, and so I think that we've all had that happen. I've definitely had situations over the last, you know, 10 plus years that I've been doing this where it feel it doesn't feel good.

Right. Yeah. Because in that moment, the client feels sold to mm-hmm. And not in a good way. And you feel like the sleazy. Salesperson, which no, it doesn't feel good for anybody because that's not the intention behind it. Right, right. So what do you do to be able to go from that situation to try to sell another album to someone else again?

Right, right. So that's like the gap of like, how do you recover from that? Be able to like wipe that icky feeling off, shake that off. Shake that off. Mm-hmm. And then move on to the next one so that you can serve your clients. Right. So when we were talking about this topic, you, something that really, um, meant a lot to me was, you know, you have to trust yourself and your intentions.

You know, it was not the intention to be, you know, a, a quote unquote slimy salesperson Yes. Or sleazy salesperson. It was like trying to do what they felt was best for the client and what you feel is best for the client. Um, but when you're in that situation and that has occurred, it's. There has been steps that have been missed.

Yes. So how do you, as a business owner, you and Ben together re quote unquote recover from that without ever getting yourself into that situation? What is, what is the key to that? So, I think there are three steps, um, that you really wanna take after you've had a seal gone wrong like that to fully recover.

The first one is to, um, just. Acknowledge your side of things. Right. Ownership of that. Ownership of that, yeah. And, and your intention. So really get clear on your intention because I've had this happen before where. A client mistakes your intention because steps were missed and we can get into that too.

That's sort of under my like third part that I wanted to talk about. Yes. I see you're very organized with your notebooks. I have. I have to take notes 'cause this is a really important topic, so I didn't wanna miss anything. So the first one is to reconnect with your own intentions. So knowing that, okay.

The client took this differently than you intended, right? Mm-hmm. So what was your intention? Well, in this case, her intention was she loved this client, she loved this wedding. She wanted to wow this client. She made her an album that was even more beautiful than what was included in her package, and in her intention was in instead of service to her client, right?

Her intention was never to be salesy. So to just like sit back and, and say like, okay, I get that my intention was mistaken here. But I know in my heart that this was what I meant, right? Because as creatives, we never wanna feel right salesy. Like we just want, we just want people to buy all of our beautiful things, right?

And just everything off, we don't actually take it off. Never wanna take anybody's money. We just want them to have it all for free. You know what I mean? So it becomes hard to eat at that point though. Yes. Yes. Yeah. Like we, we have to, and you know what? People, people actually love to buy. People love to spend money, but there's a right and a wrong way to get there.

Yep. Yeah, for sure. Um, so. In this whole scenario of serving your clients in communication, like what is your initial steps to not get to that place where the intentions are, are mixed? Like what is your first communication path with a client? Um, well, I think first it's, it's also important, so two things I like to do.

What, what I call a, like a postmortem. When something goes wrong, and this is from my agency days where. We as a team, we would get together and we would kind of go over, okay, what happened? What was the good, what was the not so good? Yeah. Where did things fall off the rails? Okay. And I think when you really take the emotion out of it and you get clear on, okay, what were the steps that I took and why did this go wrong?

Really considering it from the client's perspective. Um, this, especially when we're, we're creatives too, it's so easy to let the emotion take over and you kind of miss. The blind spots. So from the client's perspective, in this example, she loved her wedding experience with this photographer. She loved her pictures.

She already paid for an album. So she thought she was done. She thought she was done. Yeah, there was. There was no communication. Yeah, there was no expectation setting. There was no desire building. There was no talk about the benefits to a bigger album, none of that. Right. None of that occurred. Yeah. So when you think about, think about when you go to like a dealership for a new car.

I love how you use an analogy as, here, here's my analogy. You're speaking my language. So you go to a dealership for a new car, right? And they tell you. Service is your six month service is already included. That is a benefit to you. You're like, excellent, good. You buy the car, you get to your six month included service, you're sitting in, you know, having your complimentary coffee, and they come out and they're like, great news.

We also installed an upgraded air filter. Into your car, that'll be just $400, and that's going to give you better fuel efficiency. It's gonna be quiet. Your car will run quieter and smoother, and it's better for the environment. $400, please. And you're like, whoa, whoa, whoa. Wait a second. I already paid for the car.

This is supposed to already be included. I know nothing about this air filter and why I should want it. And all I'm hearing is that this is $400 that I was not planning on spending. Right. Mm-hmm. Exactly. That's basically what happened in this album example. Right. So when does that, when would that communication, let's talk about the air filter.

Yeah. When should have that been introduced and not, um, be such a blow at six months? So that should No, no pun intended. On blow in an air filter, you know? I love it. I love it. So that is like, imagine that experience went like this. You're shopping for new cars. And you're checking out a few different dealerships and you, you fall in love with this car.

You test drive it, it drives great and at that point your, um, the dealer says to you, this car already has X, Y, Z installed. And the great news is at six months you're going to get a complimentary service where we refresh the fluids and you know, change the fluids, whatever. And I wanna tell you about this really exciting air, air filter that we have too.

We don't put it in your car right now. Because you need to get your first several thousand miles and whatever reason, and this air filter really is ideal for your car at six months. And so here's what this air filter does for you. It will save you two miles a gallon on gas. Um, it will, it's better for the environment.

It your car is gonna run silent and it's gonna be the smoothest ride ever, all for this air filter. If you decide you want that at six months, we'll totally put that in for you. It's just $400. Okay, cool. Then when you sign. On the, on the line for this car. They're like, great, here's what's included, and here's what you also get a chance to upgrade at these points throughout the process, right?

Mm-hmm. Then you're driving your car, you're loving the experience of driving the car. Every so often they're gonna get send you emails about like, did you know you also have this benefit? Oh, don't forget, here's this really fancy air filter that's gonna do all these incredible things for you. It's gonna end up saving you this much money by the end, you know?

Mm-hmm. All these things. So by the time you get to your six month appointment. For that maintenance. You already, you already want that. You were like, give me that air filter. I want that air filter. I it a month ago. Here's my $400. Yeah. Yeah. That's the difference in, I think where a lot of people have a sale gone wrong.

I've definitely made this mistake too, because it can be scary or intimidating to talk about. Products and pricing and when, especially when you don't know if somebody wants that. Yes. But you have to give them the opportunity to want it. Right. Right. Mm-hmm. So that starts with education. That starts with inspiration.

And really building that desire through the process. Yeah. I like how you said a few minutes ago, desire building. Mm-hmm. So make sure and write that down, that that's, yeah. That's something that everybody watched along. Should, should just jot down because that in itself you can, you can look at those two words and build a whole repertoire of communication mm-hmm.

Off of that. And, you know, you think about a, a retail environment like when you went to the Mall of America last night when you guys were avoiding the storm. Yep. Um, you know. Every store in there has a way of building desire for the products that they're selling inside. You know, it's not just a plain window with nothing in it with a, you know, nobody greeting you when you walk in the door.

Like it's showing the product. It's the full wardrobe or, you know, cool home furnishings or whatever. They're, they're enticing you. They, right. You have to have the desire. Um, you know, and I go back to, I think I'm a textbook consumer. I don't really know what I want until I see it or until I want it. Yes.

You know, that's why when you go into Target to buy toothpaste, you leave $400 lighter. Yeah. You know, and with a basket full of stuff, you go, well, I want this and I want this, I love this. Right. You know, so that is a, that's a perfect way, and I'm really glad that you described it that way. Like you have to build that desire.

Yeah. You have to have that communication and you have to get people understanding the value of what you're giving them. Yes, yes. Yes. Exactly. So in that circumstance, um, as you're walking through. The, the experience in your studio and the communication. So, um, how does that look from your perspective building up to where you would have that suggestion of the add-on?

Because I know selling a large album, we're actually gonna look at one in a minute here that we saw being made this morning. How do you build that excitement and desire and value to your clients? Um, I think a lot of it has to do with having a personal connection to what you're selling. Mm-hmm. So there are certain things in our studio that we don't offer.

The things that we do offer are the things that I feel really connected to, and albums are one of them. And we have a dozen albums already in our home. Um, it's something that I just feel deeply connected to, so it's really easy for me to talk about it. Yep. To my clients. And so. Our process looks very similar to that air filter example where we are talking about products on our website.

We are talking about, um, products from like when somebody first drops an inquiry with us and we go through our sales process, whether it be for. Like on our weddings or whether, whether it be for portraits, there's always a mention about products right up front we talk about investment range that people, that people spend.

Um, so you're, you're being very frank about what your expectations are from the client. Yeah. Yes. Um, they, we have a, uh, so I actually. Teach like the sales process for, it's very un salesy, it's booking process, but part of that is like also pre-qualifying the client too. Mm-hmm. So we've got a questionnaire that talks about albums and if you feel like the quality of print changes how you feel about a picture, and these are like little things, um, that we will ask to make sure we're on the same page.

And then that also lets me know too, okay. They're not sold on an album. I know that the album is gonna give them something really beautiful in their, their life that they're going to have forever. Right? Yeah. Um, and so it's, it's a disservice to my client. To not really help them understand, and then they get to make the choice on their own.

So it's never, I'm never pushy or salesy, but I bring samples of albums to things, um, so that they can touch and feel them. And with my newborn clients, especially, I bring samples during my session because everything I do is on location now. Yeah. And people love them. They're immediately like, yes, I want this.

I want this for my child. Right. I want this for my life. So, as long as you brought that up Yes. With the newborn client. Let's just kind of take a peek at this. So, yes. Um, just so everybody knows, um. We actually built this album, um, in front of your eyes this morning. Yes. Um, so this is a, a premium leather and it has, um, Fuji luster photo, uh, pages in it with a, uh, thick white insert.

So you've got 24 spreads in here. Mm-hmm. I believe so. This is a nice size album. Um, you'll notice it has the rounded corners on the cover, but maybe we can sneak in on. Just grabbing a few kind of details here. So yeah, so this was there. This is the entire journey of this baby's first year from pregnancy through to newborn in six months in one year.

These are really popular in our studio because now like the baby, their baby, these babies change so much within one year. So much growth happens, right? That just what a gift to be able to have this to look through. Oh, incredible. And you are selling this at the newborn session? Yes. So the, the client is planning for having Yes.

This full album from the, for the full year. Yes. Right from the beginning. So you guys again are pre-qualifying your clients. Mm-hmm. You know that you're shooting for that. Yes. That's awesome. Yeah. You know, this is beautiful. That's got the debasing on the cover. Yeah. And this is a client that we've worked with for years and years and years.

This is their second baby. Okay. So now they've got, they have a collection of albums, just like we have in our own home. They love every single one of them. They have a whole, we actually did a whole gallery wall Yeah. Of prints from each of their first year sessions from both babies that we also combined with some of their weddings.

So it's like a. Canvas gallery wall. That's really cool in their living room right now. That's, that's awesome. Yeah. So before we dive down the, the lofty goals and the 150,000, 12 months, all that thing, all that stuff, I do want to go back so we don't forget to do it and talk about the postmortem discussion of, of something that went wrong because I think that's a very important topic to discuss here.

So when you go through that, that process of looking at where things potentially fell down or did fall down Yes. Um. And the recovery from it. How, how do you do that? Like if you, if you went through that experience and you're kind of shut down and you're scared and you know, like, I don't know what I'm gonna do, how, how is it, how is it that you recover?

Yeah. Basically. Yeah. So it's first really getting clear with your own intentions and releasing any sort of. Guilt or that you might feel any of those negative feelings that you might feel. And just checking back in, I did this for my client, this was not about a sale, right? This was about creating something really beautiful for my client and serving.

Yep. Um, then checking in with their perspective. So really that's the postmortem part where you really break down, this is exactly what happened from what my client saw. These are all of the steps. And then the third piece to that is the recovery piece, which is okay, considering my perspective.

Considering their perspective. 'cause there's always two sides and they can look very, very different. Yes, I can see super clearly what happened because of that postmortem, because of going through those steps. Now I, I need to update my process to educate, inspire, build desire. So that's like putting products everywhere you show up online, social media, website.

Talking about products, sharing your excitement about them. If you're excited about a product, like how, when we're excited about albums, that excitement is really easy to feel when it's genuine, right? Absolutely. And so our clients get excited and then they can start to picture like, okay, in 10 years, when.

My, this baby is now, you know, a 10-year-old girl. She's gonna have all of this to look back on and just remember how important and special she was. Um, and so it's building those steps in of like. Right up front, people know what you're about. It's in your brand. And then there's communication all along the way.

There's transparency all along the way and, um, and that just follows through so that you're building desire and there's never any surprises. It's really all about like proactive communication. Right. You know, and, and I'll add, you know, my little perspective to this too. You know, when you're working with a client, it's not about.

You right, or you, it's about them. Yes. You know, and whether you're right, wrong, or indifferent, if the goal is to keep that client or to keep that client from causing damage, you have to do much more than what they would ever expect. To try to make things correct. Yes. If you so choose, you know, and, and making sure that that gap is closed.

You might never, ever wanna see that client again. And you certainly don't want them to refer people like them, but that is, you know, you have to have that, that ownership of what potentially went wrong that you caused Yes. You know, and be able to be like, yep. I screwed up. Yep. This was incorrect. This is how I'm fixing it, and now we're going to move on.

Try to shove that negative energy away and build on the positive. Yes. And I think it's really easy to feel defensive and feel like, well, that's not how, that's not how I meant it. That's why are they getting so mad? And to feel like, like you're the one who's been wronged because you know your own intention.

But it's. Taking ownership and just getting clear on, okay, well what, what might have they been feeling in that moment too? Right. And sorry, goes a long way. It does if you, if they've had experience, sorry. Yeah, an apology, sort of like an explanation of your own intentions and a bless and release a redo of that album.

Remove the four spreads, give them something beautiful. Um, maybe gift them a spread something, gift them some sort of. You know, upgrade. Um, and like there is a way to recover from that by going above and beyond. Because Can I share a little story about a product situation? Yes. That actually led us to White House.

Yes, absolutely. So before we used White House for our wall art, for our framing, we sell a lot of frames. We had been using a company that's actually out of business now. Um, and our client that we've served for years, we did their engagement, their wedding family. Um, they had hung this framed print on the wall and the frame broke.

It fell off the wall. Um, and so she reached out to me and she just said, I'm really disappointed. We spent a lot of money on this frame and this frame like fell off the wall and we were expecting more. And so that was devastating because I love this client. Right? And those are hard words. Yes. Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Disappointed is the worst word, isn't it? That's a hard one. Yeah. Yeah, so, so in that moment. I, we reached out and I said, well, can you tell me how you hung it? And so they had actually hung it the wrong way and she wrote back and was like, oh, oh my bad. You know what? Like I, we hung it the wrong way. It's our fault.

So I said, Nope. We were already questioning the quality of those frames. Anyways, we would love to reprint that for you with our new printer, white House custom color, and, um, and replace that order for you. And so she said, okay. And the next piece showed up and it was beautiful and Wellmade, and she has been with us ever since.

And that was probably you, FA, six, eight. Yeah. Somewhere between five and 10 years. The years just, I know they just kind of blame. They just go now. Um, and she's been with us ever since, and our prices have increased, our product quality has increased. It's all gone up. And she's, she's been with us so sometimes.

A sale gone wrong or something gone wrong in your business can actually be an opportunity to provide next level customer service. Absolutely. And keep that client for life 1000%. Yes. And and for those of you in the back, make sure that you rewind that and listen to it again and turn it up real loud. Yes.

Because that, that is 100% true, no doubt about it. Yeah. So, um. Before we move on here, I want to talk about Ben's introduction into the business and like how that all ties together with your sales, with your communications, with what he does. With what you do. But, and, and I think this is important to note, 'cause there's a lot of, um, husband, wife teams out there.

Mm-hmm. And you guys worked constantly. Your, your little 4-year-old noticed that. Checked you on it. Mm-hmm. And you guys had to figure out, you know, what to do from there. Right. Um, and you made the right choice. But in that choice, what was your plan? To get him out of civil engineering and to make an additional $150,000 in 12 months.

Yeah, that's, uh, I had to put on my big girl pants Yeah. And start treating my business like a business and holding myself to a higher, like standard. Mm-hmm. So, um, it was nothing fancy. This doesn't need to be hard or fancy. We, we literally sat down the two of us, I still remember it really vividly. We had like an 11 by 17 sheet of paper and a black sharpie marker.

And we, we had figured out prior to that we had figured out our. Our budget and what we really needed to bring in, taking into account all of these things that you need to think about, healthcare and taxes and, and all of this stuff, the additional costs that you have to have for business and for personal in order to support yourself.

Yep. And we figured out that we had to make, bring in an additional $150,000. And we gave ourselves 12 months to do it because we said we could only deal with this lifestyle for one more year. Okay. So he was still in his role? Yes. So you, you, you added a ton more work during that 12 months mm-hmm. Kind of as a like, uh, a reality check.

Yes. Like, can we do this? Yes. Yeah. So we broke down on that sheet of paper what our business plan was, and it was to photograph, um, 30 weddings. At $5,000 a wedding. And then, um, I don't remember exactly how many portraits or what our average was, but at that point we needed to get really serious. This was no longer a hobby.

This was a business that needed to make a certain sales average per client in order to hit our goals. And I think when so important for photographers to set goals, because I had been wishy-washy for quite a while. Mm-hmm. And it was fine. It was working fine for us. Right. But if you don't ever really get clear on what your goal is, you're never gonna attain it.

Right. Um, and nearly everything is attainable once you have a goal and a plan to get there as long as you show up and do the work. Mm-hmm. Right. So we had to take our business from, I think it was making around 80 ish thousand dollars. Yep. To, we ended up getting it to $225,000. Basically right at that 12 month mark and Ben put his notice in and that was, um.

2014. So te this is our 10th year. Wow. Um, as a husband and wife team. Congratulations. Thank you. And, and you still put up with him? He puts up with me. Let's be honest, Ben Ewing is a saint. Uh, that's funny. So I know that the, the goal of life. And what your life looks like is very, very important to you.

Mm-hmm. It's not all about, you know, financial, it's family and, and the boys and all that stuff. Like, yes. What is your plan for the future as the, the, um, the scheme of your life is adapting and changing? Like have you adapted that 30 weddings and average order and everything to fit your current lifestyle or how, how have you developed in the last 10 years?

So it's been a lot. Um, we. I love evolving. Mm-hmm. I think it keeps things spicy and sparkly and new. Yep. Um, and squirrel. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Uh, and so now our weddings look very different. So now we take about 15 weddings a year. We shoot photo and video. Um, and so we are able to, um, make significantly more per booking, which is lovely.

We can be home more with our kids who play. Yeah. A lot of baseball, a ridiculous amount of baseball. And so we get to watch a ridiculous amount of baseball now. Um, but yes, work life balance is really important. Um, giving our kids experiences that we never had, so really being able to travel. Um, my youngest Cooper has lofty goals and so, um, he had this one goal, and this is, this is, this is a lot about like.

Our approach to life, I think is summed up in Cooper's goal. So when he was about five or six, he said, um, mom and dad, by the time I'm, by the time I'm 11, I want to have gone to Disney World Hawaii. Hmm. In Paris. Wow. At 11? Yes. At 11. Hmm. So at first we were like, okay, excuse me, how are you gonna get there?

How are you gonna do that? Get to mowing some lawns. Yes. And so I loved that because that was a big, beautiful goal, right? Mm-hmm. And so he saw the potential for that and he didn't see any reason why it wouldn't happen, right? Right. And so we connected on that and we said, we also love this goal, and you know what?

By the time you're 11, we also wanna do all of these things, so let's do it. Mm-hmm. So we went to Disney World maybe the next year. Um. We, uh, with the pandemic, we were able to, because everything was remote, they were remote schooling. We had the opportunity to spend a month living in Maui. Wow. Um, in 2021, which was absolutely incredible.

That sounds terrible. It was. Why would you want to do something February in Maui versus Boston, right? Yes. Um, and so we spent a month in Hawaii and it was. Absolutely incredible. And it changed all of our lives. Mm-hmm. And we will be heading to Paris, um, for the week of Thanksgiving this November.

Fantastic. And then we've also added on London, because Cooper, as long as you're there, Cooper was like, is London on the way to Paris? Can we stop there too? I'd really love, love to keep the Westminster Abby. So, so that's what we're doing. So yeah, I think that the ability, this job has given us the ability to really create.

This life that you know. It might not have ever seemed possible before. Yeah. That's awesome. So speaking of the pandemic, we're, we're gonna close with this here, a little discussion about how your physical business space has changed as well too. Mm-hmm. So you mentioned when we were on the call in 2020, your, I think it was a five year lease.

Mm-hmm. Came due in November. Is that correct? Of 2020? Yes. Yes. And you guys made the decision then, because I think we all were like, well. Where is the world going with all this? We, we don't know, um, of moving out of the, the brick and mortar studio and having offices out of your home. Yep. And you started doing your, your sales appointments via Zoom.

Yes. So I think it's very important knowing that you are achieving a certain level of success. How did that transition go with your clients? Did everything move seamlessly? How do the communications work with that? It was actually very seamless. Okay. Um, I loved our studio space, so we had a, a brick and mortar studio for 10 years.

Yep. Um, this second studio space, we had, we custom designed thanks to Ben's civil engineering prowess. It had bamboo floors, it had just beautiful doors. It was like a dream studio. Yeah. And so to walk away from that in 2020 was. A little bittersweet. We just realized that we didn't need it anymore and that our clients actually preferred a more remote experience.

Okay. I think everybody just got used to doing things more remotely. Mm-hmm. And there's such a convenience there for, a lot of our clients are in downtown Boston, so we're out in the burbs. They would have to drive to us and coordinating with kids' schedules for, even if people were local, it's, there was a lot more coordination where now it just feels.

More easy for everybody. Okay. And, um, we have a lot of clients who stick with us and so they already know the process and they're like, yep, just help me fix my favorite image. As Erica, I already know we're getting an album. I already know we're adding wall art. We do, we use, um, fundee and so we do all of our designs like all.

Either go to my client's homes, if it's a newborn session, I'm already there. I'll snap photos of their walls. I'll come up with designs for them, show them that virtually, um, for those sessions, I bring samples. They can see them in person, get to know what they like, get to envision what they want for their family.

And then we just. Take care of it over Zoom. That's awesome. So easy. So you're really doing a, a very hybrid system where you're, you're bringing product to the session mm-hmm. Appointments. So you're, you're doing a style consult with them ahead of time. Yep. Part of your communication, you're discussing products at that point, listening to what their wants and needs are, and then bringing samples with you so they can touch and feel it.

Yes. So then during the Zoom meeting, it's not. You trying to sell them something you've already done that they know what they're getting. Yes. It's just a matter of here's what I recommend for your wall display. Let's just choose the images. Yes, yes. And that's awesome. So you're really pre-design the whole experience through so you don't have to.

Recover a sale. Yes. At that point. Mm-hmm. I like how I tie that all together. I love it. I've had my coffee today. Nice little nut. Yeah, right. Yeah, exactly. Well done. Yeah, so this has been fantastic and you know, a, again, when, you know, you sent me options for discussions today. I really, when I saw that, I'm like, yes, I want to, I want to talk about that because I think it's something that, you know, we all kind of walk around like what happens if it doesn't go right and how, how do you save it?

Can you save it? You know, what, what can you do to not get yourself. Into that situation. Right? Yeah, for sure. So obviously, you know, you come from a wealth of knowledge within your own business, but you also do education. Mm-hmm. And you, your coaching, your teaching, can you tell us like where people could find you online, uh, a little bit about, you know, kind of what you help with with certain businesses mm-hmm.

And, and then we'll close that after that. Sure. So you can find us at the Ewings Studio on Instagram. Okay. Um, I follow that account. Hey, I follow you back. Be the hive. They'll follow, be the hive in you in photography studio. Um, and I help. Right now my programs are more specific to wedding photographers and, and professionals, creatives, um, who are having a real, who are struggling to.

Build that desire with their inquiries. So right now it's really, it really is hard. It's a hard market to be in. It's a, there's a lot of competitors. Everybody is very, there's a lot of talent in our industry, right? Yes, there is. And so how do you stand out and showcase your value in a way that is different, in a way that's gonna set you apart from the crowd and really build that desire so that you create this experience?

Kind of like the air filter experience we were talking about. Where someone inquires with you about potentially you shooting their wedding, they may be a little interested. They might also be inquiring on like 15 other photographer sites. Right? Right. How do you build that value and create a pre-client experience that has them excited to not only respond to your email.

To book a consult with you and before their consult, they're like pretty much already ready to book. They just wanna confirm that their hunch that you're the right fit for them, um, is, is reality. And so it's really as a combination of like messaging and then a booking process that just feels really good.

I don't love selling, I'm gonna tell you that it's, I've been doing this for 15 years. I don't love selling, but I love serving and I love. Ooh, that's a good one. That's a good quote. I'm pointed at the camera. That's a good one. Um, and so to me, I really wanted to create a way that that helped show the value there.

Mm-hmm. Helped right. Fit clients, see that I'm the right fit for them and vice versa, that they're the right fit for me. 'cause I don't wanna serve everybody. I've been doing this for a long time. Mm-hmm. There are, there are people out there that I don't wanna serve, but there's somebody else is better for them.

Yeah. Um, and that's okay. It's like there's a lid for every pot's. Yeah. Oh, there's another, there's another good one. It's a lid for every pot. So, um, so that's what it's all about is really dialing in your message around your RightFit client, building a, a bookings process that just feels really good to everybody involved.

Okay. Awesome. Well, this has been fantastic and we, we love having you guys here. We have a busy afternoon set up for you. Um, you're gonna see some wall display products. We're gonna have lunch, we're gonna have a great dinner tonight. So thank you again for, for your discussion today and taking your time to hang out with us and the guy in the back.

Thank you for having us. Yes. We appreciate it. Absolutely. So, uh, again, if you have questions after you've watched the, the, the live here on recording, make sure and put them into the comments. We'll go ahead and, and reach out to Eric and get her to answer any questions you have. Make sure and follow along, um, on Instagram at W HCC Pro.

Um, hit the subscribe button on our WCC YouTube, and for all of your product questions, um, check out wcc.com. This has been lovely. Thank you again. Thank you, and, uh, we hope you've enjoyed this and we'll see you the next one.